Skirmishes: What Gives?

shadow8803shadow8803 ✭✭
edited November 25 in The Bridge
I’m a relatively new player (~6 months), and as has been reiterated over and over again by players, both old and new, skirmishes are one of the events you can rank in more easily if you have the time to put into it.

So, I was doing my five arena runs for the klingon ship, which I fortunately already have at level 10. But I started thinking about it, and realized I’m probably never going to use the sarcophagus because I just...don’t like it. I WOULD use it, of course, if it came up as a featured ship in a skirmish event. I have a few other ships at level 10 as well, all likely to remain unused unless during a skirmish. Yes, a variety of level 10 ships is good for voyaging, but...never mind that.

My point is this: Without judgement or anger, I would like an honest answer from DB as to why skirmish events are so few and far between? Does it have to do with skirmishes making less revenue? Do skirmishes tax servers more heavily? Are they harder to code, or require more babysitting by staff when they’re going on? Like I said, at this point I just want an idea as to why we keep seeing faction after faction after galaxy after faction, when skirmishes seem to be in demand when you see player posts and opinion polls. Frankly, I would like to have a reason to use some of my ships, even ones I don’t care for, just for variety. And, I’m still willing to put in the time to rank in skirmishes because I know I can. Factions and galaxies...not so much. That’s more time in-game, with my eyeballs on STT, watching ads and such, that DB wouldn’t get otherwise. I know I’m not the only one.

With the advent of new ships possibly being released (there’s evidence out there something is coming)...please include more skirmishes in the event schedule. I’m good with hybrid events that include skirmishes as well, just something. There are many who post here, on Reddit, and in fleet chats that are pining for reasons to be excited, or even log in. This might help.

P.S.: I know I’m unlikely to get a genuine answer from DB, I’m just putting this out there. Honestly, I don’t think my question is unreasonable. And, if a reasonable answer were posed by DB, even one that explains why skirmishes are and must stay rarer than other events, I’m okay with that.

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Comments

  • Well i am not with DB, but i guess people put more money in crewpacks and chrons. Than in shippacks.
  • ByloBandByloBand ✭✭✭✭✭
    The Sarcophagus was actually featured in a skirmish a few months back, so there is that.

    I can only speculate as to an answer to your question, but I suspect the company has a real love-hate relationship with skirmishes; they probably generate the least revenue, but the players love them so much they cannot get rid of them outright, but every time they run one the gap until the next one seems to get larger.
  • shadow8803shadow8803 ✭✭
    edited November 25
    Well i am not with DB, but i guess people put more money in crewpacks and chrons. Than in shippacks.

    Right, I think that's true. But there is still crew to be had in event packs on skirmish weeks. And as far as chrons go, I'll just say this: For the rerun skirmish where Pike was the reward, I managed to come out of the skirmish with slightly more chrons than I went in with, which was great. For the Mudd-mega skirmish where Vina was the reward, I started the event with 15k chrons (remember, I'm new), and ended with 1500. RNJesus was not with me on that one. So, if there are others who experienced the same, I would think the chron packs still sell (maybe less than galaxy events, but still...).
    ByloBand wrote: »
    The Sarcophagus was actually featured in a skirmish a few months back, so there is that.

    I can only speculate as to an answer to your question, but I suspect the company has a real love-hate relationship with skirmishes; they probably generate the least revenue, but the players love them so much they cannot get rid of them outright, but every time they run one the gap until the next one seems to get larger.

    Though I realize the people who post online (via DB forums, Reddit, etc.) are a small fraction of those who actually play the game, I feel that people commenting they are frustrated with the lack of event variety is increasing. For all we know, maybe the game really is on maintenance mode and it doesn't really matter, which would be a shame. But even if that's the case, why not throw the players a bone and have a skirmish at least once a month?

    And, I wonder if DB has thought of this: If revenue is an issue, and is indeed the reason why low-earning skirmish events are rare, then say so. I think there are a lot of people who would still care enough to try and help. Maybe crowd source player ideas for more revenue (subscription service beyond monthly card and campaigns, other pack types...IDK, we could think of something). The lack of communication and clear reasoning behind some of the decisions being made just makes players angrier. Peoples' love for Star Trek will only go so far. If anything, maybe DB should consider posting a monthly Dev blog or a quarterly FAQ...it doesn't seem that much to ask.

    As I typed all that...I realized I'm probably living in a dream world. Oh well, I'll be delusional if I want to be.
  • Tangentially, I hear many players lament the fewer number of event packs included in the skirmish event offers to "make space" for ship schematics. I have to imagine that Skirmish event packs would sell better if schematics were 'in addition to' rather than 'instead of'.

    Yes, that's a good question. If Faction event offers include shuttle boosts as well as the normal number of event packs, then why not do the same with ship schematic packs on skirmish weekends? They'd probably sell better. Yes, I realize schematics are rarer than shuttle boosts, but I still think they'd move quicker.
    Also, skirmishes would sell tons of ship packs if the bonus ship gave extra firepower which made the battles shorter or gave more points. Right now bonus ships just add health which is not very good.

    Also a good point. Once you have a level 10 ship, and one or two crew that are decent in space combat (and no, you DON'T need Killy/Commandant), skirmish battles not overly difficult. Increased power wouldn't really break anything, IMO.
  • Dirk GundersonDirk Gunderson ✭✭✭✭✭
    Also, skirmishes would sell tons of ship packs if the bonus ship gave extra firepower which made the battles shorter or gave more points. Right now bonus ships just add health which is not very good.

    On a simpler note, I imagine ship pack sales would be better if they were less expensive or included more schematics. Maybe instead of one guaranteed event ship and a bunch of 3* ships nobody really needs, how about guaranteed drops of every featured ship and guaranteed 4*/5* schematics thereafter?

    Although I am sure DB has had brainstorming sessions to figure out how to better monetize Skirmishes, it really breaks down into only a few categories:

    -crew packs
    -schematics packs
    -special offers
    -bonus rewards

    Other than the aforementioned tweaks to schematics packs, I’m not sure what could be done to make the first three much more attractive without potential breaking something else. As for bonus rewards, maybe have two options for purchase rather than one - standard bonus rewards and “Exceptional” bonus rewards. While the basic bonus rewards would be left untouched, the Exceptional rewards could be 25, 50, or 100 dil apiece and include event ship schematics, 1-4 single premium pulls, Intel, larger chunks of honor, uncommon starbase components, and perhaps even a premium 10-pull as a low-probability reward?
  • Just my opinion, but until we get a better ship display situation, like the crew quarters maybe?, more ships cause scroll fatigue. Lol. We really need an updated ship docking bay with a more organized manner to display ships.
    As far as what event is playing, everybody has an opinion or a favorite. That aside, What ive noticed is that when we do get a skirmish it is rarely a mixed event? If all above comments about revenue are in fact a part of the problem, then a mixed event of faction or galaxy with skirmish could go a long way to solve that. In these cases, the event packs could be mixed with ship pks/chrons/crew pks/shuttle packs, depending on the 2 parts of the event.
    And there is still the long forgotten expedition event. As far as programming it should be as easy as faction events bcuz it is basically a duplicate of galaxy map basic missions. But we see only 1 a year now? Whats the deal there?
    Again everyone has their favorite event. But in reality we do have 4 types of events that could be randomly mixed to alleviate some of the event repetition.
  • Ren~Ren~ ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 27
    IMO one of the issues here is that people often demand new ships for skirmishes, and I'm quite sure they're the most expensive asset to create by far. I don't believe in the "people spend less with skirmishes" thing as monetisation there is even more aggressive than in faction events. You can just buy your way to victory no questions asked, after all. If DB could just reuse the same ships all the time with no complaints then I'm sure we'd get that kind of event more often. The less work you ask from DB the more likely they are to run a given kind of event.
  • Ren~ wrote: »
    IMO one of the issues here is that people often demand new ships for skirmishes, and I'm quite sure they're the most expensive asset to create by far. I don't believe in the "people spend less with skirmishes" thing as monetisation there is even more aggressive than in faction events. You can just buy your way to victory no questions asked, after all. If DB could just reuse the same ships all the time with no complaints then I'm sure we'd get that kind of event more often. The less work you ask from DB the more likely they are to run a given kind of event.

    Even though what you said about the effort of ship design is true it does not explain why there are not more reruns or flashbacks of skirmishes.
    Von wegen harmlos und flauschig! Die [Mirror] Tribbles rekrutieren wieder. Euch erwarten: Starbase lvl. 134, Discord und eine nette, hilfsbereite Gemeinschaft.
  • Ren~Ren~ ✭✭✭✭
    edited November 27
    Ren~ wrote: »
    IMO one of the issues here is that people often demand new ships for skirmishes, and I'm quite sure they're the most expensive asset to create by far. I don't believe in the "people spend less with skirmishes" thing as monetisation there is even more aggressive than in faction events. You can just buy your way to victory no questions asked, after all. If DB could just reuse the same ships all the time with no complaints then I'm sure we'd get that kind of event more often. The less work you ask from DB the more likely they are to run a given kind of event.

    Even though what you said about the effort of ship design is true it does not explain why there are not more reruns or flashbacks of skirmishes.

    There were only two skirmishes outside of mega events, one was Interfaced La Forge (and we got that one already) and the other one was Maid Marian.
    DB would have to rerun skirmishes from megas and so far they seem to have no desire to do so.
  • Travis S McClainTravis S McClain ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November 27
    shadow8803 wrote: »
    I’m a relatively new player (~6 months), and as has been reiterated over and over again by players, both old and new, skirmishes are one of the events you can rank in more easily if you have the time to put into it.
    And there is still the long forgotten expedition event.

    Skirmishes are essentially Expeditions with ship battles instead of away missions created. Much as I love both, even I would find them too fatiguing for a greater frequency than more or less monthly. (I still think rerunning Expeditions as Expedition/Skirmish hybrids would be fantastic.)
  • Travis S McClainTravis S McClain ✭✭✭✭✭
    There's the matter of ships. On DB's side, as @Ren~ rightly notes, they're probably one of the most demanding things to design. They're in 3D, after all.

    On the player side of things, it can be frustrating to collect enough schematics for a favorite ship to be useful. They're too weak to use in the Skirmishes where they're Featured; too weak for the Arena; and won't get you much starting AM in Voyages.
  • Both skirmish and expedition events cater FTP imo. Many people can put in hours and hours but dont pull out the credit card. Therefore I would suspect that regardless of people calling for more skirmishes, these events are probably not great money makers. Since you would need to put in a lot more money for PTW, while all the FTP are just logging the hours driving up the top levels.

    Then it makes sense that they only run them occassionally to appease the masses, but on the whole just appeal to the wallets.
  • There's the matter of ships. On DB's side, as @Ren~ rightly notes, they're probably one of the most demanding things to design. They're in 3D, after all.

    On the player side of things, it can be frustrating to collect enough schematics for a favorite ship to be useful. They're too weak to use in the Skirmishes where they're Featured; too weak for the Arena; and won't get you much starting AM in Voyages.

    I agree that it's probably those two things. I think skirmishes could be more remunerative for DB if the schematic packs were actually worth it. If the threshold rewards gave us enough schematics for a lv 4 or 5 ship and the packs gave a reasonable chance of actually getting the ship to at least lv 6 or 7, by buying two or three of them, I'm sure people would be happy to buy them.

    But that wouldn't change the fact that skirmishes probably require more work and are more expensive to design.
  • Prime LorQa [10F]Prime LorQa [10F] ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November 28
    I think the best points in this thread are the time / effort needed to create a new ship and the game economy regarding ship schematics. I think two things were missed.
    1) DB gains more financially when players have to deal with scarce resources. We can gain more honor during skirmishes than pretty much any other game feature, save one: buying packs. In the absence of skirmishes, players only had dailies and packs to gain honor. I don't know how much that drove sales, but... It stands to reason that DB probably sold more packs when players wanted honor and had no better way to earn it.
    2) DB probably won't weigh in on this thread. It would probably amount to peeling back the curtain behind which a certain wizard sits. If they said the wrong thing, or even the right thing, it could alienate one group of players or another. It would be interesting to be proven wrong on this point, but... I'm not holding my breath.
    Definitely an interesting discussion here. Thanks to the OP and those who have posted. I hadn't considered the ship schematic economy the way it's been laid out here. Good stuff. :)
  • I also hadnt considered ship schem economy as Ren suggests. That is probably a fact. However, ppl have figured out that the featured ship is not required for max VP and most ppl use their best ship avail. So demanding a new ship for skirmishes (while likely a very good point) would be silly 🤪 on the players part since it has no baring on VP. It is also possible that DB wants to introduce a new ship that bring in the $$ on skirmish ship pks.
    As far as flashbacks and reruns of skirmish i think it is that there havent been enough of these events to rerun, which is the point of this discussion. Why so little skirmish?. Most, If not all,(I'm not going to check all the dates), of the flashback or rerun events were new events in 2016 and 2017. We did not have skirmish then. 🖖🏻
  • Travis S McClainTravis S McClain ✭✭✭✭✭
    As far as flashbacks and reruns of skirmish i think it is that there havent been enough of these events to rerun, which is the point of this discussion. Why so little skirmish?. Most, If not all,(I'm not going to check all the dates), of the flashback or rerun events were new events in 2016 and 2017. We did not have skirmish then. 🖖🏻

    I got caught up in ship logistics and forgot to address frequency. The first was part of the "Superior Ambition" mega event, 31 May - 4 June 2018. Counting that as a June '18 event, we've had a Skirmish (or Skirmish hybrid) every month except this November. Skirmishes have not been marginalized.
  • ByloBandByloBand ✭✭✭✭✭
    Skirmishes are the best mishes!
  • First of skirmishes are boring (my point of view) repetitive events. I'd also guess that there are lot less people who buy ship packs ... (I think i may have bought 1 or 2 max since I'm playing , almost since the game came out) . As well as there's the fact that some people still bot the event ... (not pointing fingers)
    I'd also wager that the skirmish fatigue will be bigger the say the faction fatigue that most of us feel right now ...
    DB: Do Better. Disrupt the Beam's Revenue Stream.
  • Travis S McClainTravis S McClain ✭✭✭✭✭
    First of skirmishes are boring (my point of view) repetitive events. I'd also guess that there are lot less people who buy ship packs ... (I think i may have bought 1 or 2 max since I'm playing , almost since the game came out) . As well as there's the fact that some people still bot the event ... (not pointing fingers)
    I'd also wager that the skirmish fatigue will be bigger the say the faction fatigue that most of us feel right now ...

    That's cute. Trying to stir the old macro pot again. That's been hashed and re-hashed. Thanks for putting your ignorance on full display. Skirmish fatigue can be fairly easily broken by making them hybrid events. It would be nice to see more skirmish hybrids.

    Skirmishes are my favorite active format, and I have complete confidence that bot use was vanquished after it was first exposed. But if I'm being honest, that suspicion is in the back of my mind every time and it undermines some of my enthusiasm. As for fatigue, I definitely feel that when the event is over, but they're spaced out enough that I've recuperated by time the next one rolls around and excited for all the loot that awaits.
  • WaldoMagWaldoMag ✭✭✭✭✭
    Did not see this mentioned. You do not need more than one legendary ship at level 10 to do well in skirmishes. Even the worst ship can win, the Cardassian Prakash ship, though battles can become lengthy in that ship.

    I once tried almost all the ships, I actually found the NX-01 enterprise to take the shortest time for me. But, I believe is what just RNG that made it better than the IKS T'Ong for me. I chose the IKS T'Ong for all of the skirmishes except that time when I experimented. When I experimented the Prakash took the longest to win and could possibly lose one if I kept using it.
  • Data1001Data1001 ✭✭✭✭✭
    WaldoMag wrote: »
    Did not see this mentioned. You do not need more than one legendary ship at level 10 to do well in skirmishes. Even the worst ship can win, the Cardassian Prakash ship, though battles can become lengthy in that ship.

    I once tried almost all the ships, I actually found the NX-01 enterprise to take the shortest time for me. But, I believe is what just RNG that made it better than the IKS T'Ong for me. I chose the IKS T'Ong for all of the skirmishes except that time when I experimented. When I experimented the Prakash took the longest to win and could possibly lose one if I kept using it.

    I've also done a lot of experimenting with (maxed-out) 5* ships in Skirmishes, and yes, some of them are awful. ;) The T'Ong is a great choice, so is the Bounty and the Cube, and I think I did have decent luck with the NX-01, as well. But after several Skirmishes, I still find the Sarcophagus, surprisingly, to be my go-to. I never would've picked that ship had I not tried a bunch of them out.


    Could you please continue the petty bickering? I find it most intriguing.
    ~ Data, ST:TNG "Haven"
  • AviTrek wrote: »
    ByloBand wrote: »
    First of skirmishes are boring (my point of view) repetitive events. I'd also guess that there are lot less people who buy ship packs ... (I think i may have bought 1 or 2 max since I'm playing , almost since the game came out) . As well as there's the fact that some people still bot the event ... (not pointing fingers)
    I'd also wager that the skirmish fatigue will be bigger the say the faction fatigue that most of us feel right now ...

    That's cute. Trying to stir the old macro pot again. That's been hashed and re-hashed. Thanks for putting your ignorance on full display. Skirmish fatigue can be fairly easily broken by making them hybrid events. It would be nice to see more skirmish hybrids.

    The best remedy for skirmish fatigue is the following:

    1. Get a device that has a streaming service.
    2. Login to said streaming service.
    3. Load up your favorite series of Star Trek.
    4. Watch Star Trek while skirmishing.

    Once you figure out your skirmish rhythm (it takes me a few runs to get locked in) you can sort of auto-pilot the process while enjoying several episodes of your favorite show, that is the best advice I can give.

    Last full skirmish I sat on the couch with my wife and we watched an entire season of The Great British Baking Show, and I skirmished the entire time.

    If an event requires you to find something else to do in the the same time to make it palatable, there is a fundamental problem with the even to begin with.

    Counterpoint: if an event allows you to still enjoy family, friends, and normal activities while playing and being competitive, there is something fundamentally right with it that other events lack.

    TBH , the least intrusive are faction events. Skirmishing eats up you free time and makes it seem like a chore ...
    DB: Do Better. Disrupt the Beam's Revenue Stream.
  • Jim SteeleJim Steele ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2
    TBH , the least intrusive are faction events. Skirmishing eats up you free time and makes it seem like a chore ...
    I agree with this 100%.
    I also think their is no benefit to have the featured ship thus absolutely no reason to buy packs. All you need is a Krayton + Insta-damage crew like Cpt Killy & Rura Penthe Commandant.
    Now, I wish instead of an Armour bonus for the featured ship there was an ability cooldown reduction or raw damage boost. Using the Krayton I rarely loose my shield before the target is destroyed, so any additional Armour is pointless.
    DB: Do Better
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